Adding OpenTTD to Desura!

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Re: Adding OpenTTD to Desura!

Post by Dave »

Under what country's laws? I believe IP regulations differ between nations? I know it's a lot harsher in Germany than here in the UK.
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Re: Adding OpenTTD to Desura!

Post by Eddi »

german copyright explicitly excludes "ideas and concepts" for computer programs, only code and design documents are protected. with graphics it's slightly different, but there's also a paragraph that creating a "vaguely resembling" work does not need the permission of the original author.

the whole thing looks much different if you consider trademarks or patents, though.
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Re: Adding OpenTTD to Desura!

Post by michael blunck »

Eddi wrote: german copyright explicitly excludes "ideas and concepts" for computer programs, only code and design documents are protected.
No, it does not. That´s an improper abridging.

First of all, all forms of expression of a computer program are protected:
UrhG wrote: § 69a Gegenstand des Schutzes
(2) Der gewährte Schutz gilt für alle Ausdrucksformen eines Computerprogramms. [...]
In the further course, this is limited to "elements" (i.e. certain parts) of the "real code":
UrhG wrote: § 69a Gegenstand des Schutzes
(2) [...] Ideen und Grundsätze, die einem Element eines Computerprogramms zugrunde liegen, einschließlich der den Schnittstellen zugrundeliegenden Ideen und Grundsätze, sind nicht geschützt.
Please note that "Grundsätze" != "concepts" (i.e., it´s "principles").

And moreover, it doesn´t hold for the whole work (the Transport Tycoon game):
UrhG wrote: § 2 Geschützte Werke
(1) Zu den geschützten Werken der Literatur, Wissenschaft und Kunst gehören insbesondere:
1.
Sprachwerke, wie Schriftwerke, Reden und Computerprogramme;
2.
Werke der Musik;
3.
[...]
4.
Werke der bildenden Künste einschließlich der Werke der Baukunst und der angewandten Kunst und Entwürfe solcher Werke;
5.
Lichtbildwerke einschließlich der Werke, die ähnlich wie Lichtbildwerke geschaffen werden;
6.
Filmwerke einschließlich der Werke, die ähnlich wie Filmwerke geschaffen werden;
7.
Darstellungen wissenschaftlicher oder technischer Art, wie Zeichnungen, Pläne, Karten, Skizzen, Tabellen und plastische Darstellungen.
I.e., many of those points are addressed by a "computer game".

In conclusion, German copyright does not protect the way a function is set up in a certain computer program, or how a device interupt is handled, but o/c it protects the realised concept, the composition and the design of a computer game to variable degrees, provided a certain threshold of originality.

I.e. alone the "idea" of "transporting" something from "A" to "B" in a computer game would not provide that requirement, but the way this is designed and implemented in a certain game (i.e.: Transport Tycoon) by some typical execution or embodiment, and implications of player interaction might well fullfill that criterion. Thus linking the "idea" with its practical realisation might well account for copyright protection (and usually does).

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Re: Adding OpenTTD to Desura!

Post by Eddi »

UrhG wrote: § 69a Gegenstand des Schutzes
(2) [...] Ideen und Grundsätze, die einem Element eines Computerprogramms zugrunde liegen, einschließlich der den Schnittstellen zugrundeliegenden Ideen und Grundsätze, sind nicht geschützt.
whenever you bring up this argument, i'm never quite sure if you actually read the operative word there.
michael blunck wrote: And moreover, it doesn´t hold for the whole work (the Transport Tycoon game):
sure, i did mention that the graphics (and music, videos, ... if applicable) are held to another standard.
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Re: Adding OpenTTD to Desura!

Post by michael blunck »

Eddi wrote:
UrhG wrote: § 69a Gegenstand des Schutzes
(2) [...] Ideen und Grundsätze, die einem Element eines Computerprogramms zugrunde liegen, einschließlich der den Schnittstellen zugrundeliegenden Ideen und Grundsätze, sind nicht geschützt.
whenever you bring up this argument, i'm never quite sure if you actually read the operative word there.
Yes, I did:
michael blunck wrote: Please note that "Grundsätze" != "concepts" (i.e., it´s "principles").
michael blunck wrote: In conclusion, German copyright does not protect the way a function is set up in a certain computer program, or how a device interupt is handled, but o/c it protects the realised concept, the composition and the design of a computer game to variable degrees, provided a certain threshold of originality.
Eddi wrote:
michael blunck wrote: And moreover, it doesn´t hold for the whole work (the Transport Tycoon game):
sure, i did mention that the graphics (and music, videos, ... if applicable) are held to another standard.
Not only "the graphics (and music, videos, ... if applicable)", but
michael blunck wrote: the way this [idea] is designed and implemented in a certain game (i.e.: Transport Tycoon) by some typical execution or embodiment, and implications of player interaction might well fullfill that criterion. Thus linking the "idea" with its practical realisation might well account for copyright protection (and usually does).
Das ist ständige Rechtsprechung.

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Re: Adding OpenTTD to Desura!

Post by Expresso »

Eddi wrote:
kamnet wrote:
FooBar wrote:I should have emphasized the "Ensure your game [] idea is your own" bit.
This game is not our idea, it's Chris Sawyer's.
Who borrowed the idea from Artdink, who borrowed it from MicroProse, who borrowed it from Epyx and Ozark.
with all due respect, "having the idea" for a game doesn't make it one's "intellectual property". only creating actual code/graphics does.
Although this is the case at the moment (in a legal way). It seems things are moving in that direction. THIS IS WORRYING ME.

ACTA is worrying me. OpenTTD could fall in the catagory "counterfeit products" :(
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